I'd like to say of my experience that the things Shih-fu says at any given time in the retreat do have marvelous effects. It happened in my mind a couple of times. One time he said something at lunch that had to do with his grandmaster asking certain questions. Coming away from that meal, I had a sense of karmic connection with his grandmaster. And something really opened up for me in the afternoon. Another time Shih-fu told me, in his Chinese form of English, which is very direct and effective, that I consider that there's something very important to me inside a little box, that I was holding the box, but I had to continually turn the box one way and another to figure out how to open it. And those were just words, but when I went back to meditation I suddenly discovered that I was really actually having that experience, and it lifted my practice up onto another level.

I can attest that Shih-fu's words do have this quality of not just being words, but actually kindling, which brings about new levels of experience. It is also possibly true that Shih-fu's wishes for the people on retreat, his very pure Dharma wishes, without words, his concern and aspiration, have a direct impact on people. And this probably goes beyond being an expert retreat guide, and has something to do with a real transcendental connection that Shih-fu feels with people. There's really nothing that can be said about that-it's a kind of mystery and it's one of the deeper dimensions of what's going on in these retreats.

Shih-fu often describes four different conditions of mind-"scattered mind, " "simple mind, " "one mind, " and "no mind." Can you very briefly say what each one of these is?

Shih-fu: When people have just started meditation, or before they have practiced meditation, generally their mind is scattered. When a person has a lot of desires, or a lot of disappointment, or is worried about something, under those conditions, his mind is very scattered.

LH: What happens in "simple mind?"